Home studio design - first step, a door!

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drummersteve
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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#1

Postby drummersteve » Sun, 2020-Jul-12, 20:21

Hi everyone,

My first post here, I will do my best to adhere to all the forum rules, excuse me if I dont!

UK-born composer, living in Ecuador now for 2 years. We have just bought our first house, and it has a great space off the side of the house that the previous owners created. This is the space I plan to convert into the studio. I will try and describe the space as much as possible, but as briefly as possible. SketchUp design included which detail the space...

1) The space used to be part of the garden. It sits between what used to be the external wall of our house, and the perimeter wall of our garden (the two long walls). The other side of the external house wall is our living room, and the other side of the perimeter wall is the neighbours driveway. The two other walls are the shorter walls, one of which is part of our house, the other side being another room of the house. The final wall is actually a set if sliding glass windows, leading onto the garden (this is far more clear in the sketch diagrams below!)

2) The ceiling is glass. It is supported by a series of wooden joists, which themselves are supported by two other joists bolted to the two long walls running the length of the room. It's basically a pergola.

3) The access from the house to the 'studio' is just an opening. It used to be a window out to the garden, but this got knocked out, leaving a big opening. So, no door.

As mentioned above, I am a composer. A lot of my work is midi-sequencing, but i track a lot of acoustic guitar, percussion, violin etc. I also plan on bringing my drum kit over to Ecuador at some point, so I want to future-proof the space for a drum kit, if possible. My wife is a vocalist, so I plan on building an extension to use as a vocal room for her, where she can write, practice, and of course record.

It's a brief overview, but that covers the very basics of now. I've been going over various forums, and absorbing loads of materials such as Rod Gervais book, John Brandts online resources, trying to understand everything that needs to be achieved, and there's a lot still to learn. Now, my overall goals for the space are this:

Build a room within a room to achieve as much isolation as possible inside the room. I often work late, and given the proximity of my house and the neighbours, I'm hoping to achieve a space that can be worked in at any time of the day with minimal disturbance to people around. I also have a huge Alsatian dog living next door who never stops barking, so keeping him out would be ideal...! To achieve this, I first fo all need to make my current space what I'd consider 'normal' - ie, ditch the glass roof for something more normal, and ditch the glass sliding doors for something more normal. From there, I can approach the inner leaf given I have a normal room to construct it within. This also applies to the vocal room I want to build off the studio main. The idea being my wife can be in the vocal room practicing, and I can be in the studio working, and we don't interfere with one another. The same above applies to this room - first of all construct the vocal room so it is a normal room, and then approach the inner leaf etc after.

My understanding is the following: As my outer leaf currently consists of differing materials (the most massive being the walls that already exist, of 6" concrete), I need to match the thinner parts (ie the glass roof, the glass sliding doors, and the opening which will need to be a door) to the same mass as the concrete walls. This is somewhat a separate issue which I will come to later in this thread (hopefully!). However, I believe that before I can begin any form of construction, I need a door in the opening. Inevitably, I have to remove the current roof and glass sliding doors, and I cant do that if there is no door separating the studio from the house, otherwise the whole house will be exposed to the elements. So, while I still have many many steps to work through, I feel that I have to have a door in place before continuing further with any other type of construction.

So... Door time!

Again, I've been reading forum posts, looking at images, researching parts etc (hard to find stuff here in Ecuador), and also trying to design/plan how to implement the door, based on the design Rod Gervais provides in his book. I will now go into my thoughts/process/plan for the door below. (Worth mentioning now that I do plan on a double door design, as I plan on a room within a room, but for now I am talking about the outer door which will form a part of the existing outer leaf ie the concrete wall).

It has been recommended all over that the mass of the door should match the mass of the leaf. As my outer leaf is solid concrete, this is quite massive(!) Therefore, I have decided that a 'Super Door' style design is perhaps most suitable for the outer leaf. I don't know if this is overkill, given that I also plan on a secondary door as part of the inner leaf. But it has been stressed a number of times that the door should match the mass of the leaf - an ordinary solid core door would be less massive than the concrete wall, which is why I am going this way. Please advise if you disagree with this logic..!

- Solid core doors are reasonably priced here ($40 for an MDF door, $80 for solid pine, 36mm thick). I've seen that you can attach two of these together to make the door more massive, which is my plan (the door supplier can cut the door to whatever size I want for a small fee, to achieve the recesses for the seals etc). So far, so good.

- Hardware: Automatic drop thresholds are non-existent, and given the current climate, I don't feel like going through the process of international shipment. Therefore I think I will rely on the seal of a normal threshold. Perhaps in the future when I visit there US or UK, I'll order one and brink it back and get it fitted at a later date. Heavy-duty hinges and automatic closers are no problem to find.

- Seals: The trunk rubber for the seals is also not an easy find, but I've found something that appears to have a very similar shape (photo of the cross-section supplied below). If anyone can advise whether this looks suitable, that would be very helpful. Similarly, I think can source the magnetic weatherstripping (not confirmed yet but working on it).

DESIGN:

There are a load of resources online which are extremely helpful at detailing the approach/process that I could/should use, and along with an experienced carpenter, I am not too worried about implementing this (in general). However, I am having a number of queries, which leads me to my first problem.

SIZE OF DOOR/DOOR OPENING

Unlike a lot of the designs and examples I've seen online, where the opening for the door is planned at a specific size, I am dealing with an already-existing opening, with its own dimensions (again a SketchUp of this is below). This means that, given the width of the door is also set in stone by the supplier to a maximum of 910mm, I am unsure of how to fill in the gaps either side, and above, the door.

The thickness of the wall that frames the opening is approximately 158mm (6 inches). I therefore plan on using 5/4 stock lumber for the jambs (140mm). I do not intend on using a thru-jamb connecting the two leaves, purely due to the thickness of the wall which creates the outer leaf. I will basically have a space between the outer leaf and the inner leaf, covered up with some form of fabric to hide the innards. The 5/4 will be the frame of the whole door (please advise if you disagree!)

The width of the opening is 1055mm, the width of the door is 910mm. Taking in to account the thickness of the 5/4 jamb either side (approx 25mm), the total width of the door construction will be roughly 960mm. This leaves 95mm in total of space (47.5mm either side).

Similarly, the height of the opening is 2390mm. The door is 2150mm high, plus the jambs on top and bottom makes a total of 2200mm. This leaves a gap above the door construction of 190mm.

These gaps obviously cant be filled with caulk etc, so what should I do? I have tried sketching a number of combinations of additional jambs to increase the thickness of the frame, but nothing really adds up to a nice fit horizontally. Also, I wasn't sure if it was a god idea to fill the space with wood, or maybe more concrete to match the existing wall.

Once I've got this problem solved, I think I'm in a good place to proceed with building the door. So to summarise, these are my general/overall questions:


1) Given I will be doing a double-door design, is a super-door for the outer leaf (in an effort to match the mass of the outer leaf) overkill, or is it sensible?

2) Does the rubber seal I've managed to source appear to be a suitable replacement for the suggested type K from Rod Gervais book?

3) I plan on keeping two separate jambs, and covering the gap between the leaves eventually with fabric - seem ok?

4) How should I go about filling up the remaining space that will be left over around the door construction?


Once I've got the door constructed, I will feel more confident in continuing with replacing the glass roof and glass sliding doors without causing issues in the house. I will of course post specifically related to this once I pass the door...!

Thank you for reading everyone, and thank you for this great forum!
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Soundman2020
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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#2

Postby Soundman2020 » Wed, 2020-Jul-15, 00:59

Hi Steve, and welcome to the forum! :thu: :)

My first post here, I will do my best to adhere to all the forum rules, excuse me if I dont!
You are doing fine!

living in Ecuador now for 2 years
Hola vecino del norte! Nunca he ido a Ecuador, pero tengo amigos que dicen que es un país hermoso. Quizás algun día, voy de visita...

2) The ceiling is glass.
:shock: Wow! That's unusual! So I guess this was originally meant as a sun-room, or maybe a greenhouse?

How thick is that glass, and is it laminate glass?

so I want to future-proof the space for a drum kit, if possible.
:) So you want to complicate your life a bit? :D Drums are great. I love drums. But drums are hard to isolate.... Are you on good terms with your neighbors? :) More seriously, it would be good to figure out how much isolation you need, in decibels, as that's what you would need to design for: a specific number. It's not too hard to figure that out, but you'll need a hand-held sound level meter.

My wife is a vocalist, so I plan on building an extension to use as a vocal room for her, where she can write, practice, and of course record.
Question: do you intend to play and/or record both at once? In other words, might it happen that you are thrashing away on the drums while your wife is also singing?

I've been going over various forums,
... and you finally arrived at the BEST one! (</shameless-plug-for-the-forum-mode=off>).

Build a room within a room to achieve as much isolation as possible inside the room. I often work late, and given the proximity of my house and the neighbours, I'm hoping to achieve a space that can be worked in at any time of the day with minimal disturbance to people around.
This goes back to what I mentioned briefly above: it is important to put a number to that. An actual goal that says more or less: "in order to not annoy the neighbors, I need XX decibels of isolation for my studio". It could be a different number for each room: higher for the drum room, lower for the vocal room.

ditch the glass roof for something more normal,
This is why I asked about the thickness and type of glass. For two reasons: 1) If you like your glass, you might be able to keep your glass. 2) If you don't want a glass roof, then you might still be able to reuse that glass for windows in your studio. I would imagine that, if that is your current roof, it is quite thick, and possibly also laminated glass, in which case it would be ideal for studio windows, or glass panels in your studio door.

ditch the glass sliding doors for something more normal.
Here too: if you like your sliding glass doors, then maybe you can keep your sliding glass doors. It is certainly possible to have sliders for a studio. In fact, they are rather common between rooms inside a multi-room facility (between the control room and a vocal booth or live room, for example), but they could also be used as exterior doors. Here too, the question is: how thick is the glass, and what type? Also, does the sliding part have good rubber seals on it, or if not, would it be possible to add good rubber seals to it?

Of course, if you don't like the idea of sliders on your studio, then you can just switch those out for something else.

The idea being my wife can be in the vocal room practicing, and I can be in the studio working, and we don't interfere with one another. The same above applies to this room - first of all construct the vocal room so it is a normal room, and then approach the inner leaf etc after.
So, to clarify: your room is basically just a rehearsal room, and your wife's room is basically just a rehearsal room? There won't be any control room here, so no tracking / mixing / mastering?

My understanding is the following: As my outer leaf currently consists of differing materials (the most massive being the walls that already exist, of 6" concrete), I need to match the thinner parts (ie the glass roof, the glass sliding doors, and the opening which will need to be a door) to the same mass as the concrete walls.
Ideally, yes... assuming that you want the highest possible isolation. But you might find that you don't need to go that high with the other walls: you only need as much mass in the wall as is necessary to get the isolation you want. If one or two walls happen to have MORE mass than that, then that's fine. So you just need to figure out what the MINIMUM mass is that you need for the isolation number you want, then get at least that amount on each of your walls, and your roof. Isolation is only as good as the weakest part, but as long as the weakest part has what you need, then there's no problem if some other parts are better.

So, while I still have many many steps to work through, I feel that I have to have a door in place before continuing further with any other type of construction.
Sounds like a smart move!

It has been recommended all over that the mass of the door should match the mass of the leaf.
Yes, true, but with the caveat above. That advice is mostly for people who are building from scratch, or are starting out with low mass walls. In your case, you likely have more mass than you need in that concrete wall, so your door will only need to be massive enough to do the job that it has to do. Hence, the importance of having a numeric isolation number in mind ("XX decibels of isolation"), so you can calculate this, to find out just how much mass is "enough to do the job". There are equations for doing that.

Therefore, I have decided that a 'Super Door' style design is perhaps most suitable for the outer leaf. I don't know if this is overkill, given that I also plan on a secondary door as part of the inner leaf.
It can't do any harm by building an extremely massive door... except to your bank account! :) Most home studio builders are on a tight budget, and looking for ways to save a few dollars (pesos) here and there, and in your case this might be one of those places. Your door only needs to be good enough to achieve the isolation you need. Anything more than that is wasted money. Nice to have, if your pockets are deep and money is no object, but not really necessary.

an ordinary solid core door would be less massive than the concrete wall,
waaayyyy less! One square meter of concrete that is 5 cm thick will weigh around. 120 kg. One square meter of solid wood that is 5cm thick, will weigh around 35 kg. So your wood will need to be about four times thicker than the same thickness of concrete. Assuming your concrete wall is 15cm thick (6"), to get the same mass in wood, your door would need to be 60 cm thick (about two FEET thick) :shock: :!: :ahh: So this is out of the question, obviously. Wood just does not have enough density to do the job. And for the above, I'm assuming a fairly dense wood, such as oak, birch, or maple. If your wood happens to be less dense, such as pine, spruce, or cedar, then you would need an even greater thickness.

If you still wanted to match the mass of the concrete, then your best option would be a solid steel door, which could be a lot thinner: in fact, it would "only" need to be 2 1/4" thick (about 6 cm). That would have the same surface density as the concrete. Now, good luck trying to find steel plate 6cm thick! Maybe try your local ship-building yard... :) Or find a bank that is going out of business, and buy their vault door.

OK, I think you get where I'm going with this: there is no need to match the density for massively heavy walls: you only need as much mass as is necessary to do the job of providing the isolation that is your goal.

Solid core doors are reasonably priced here ($40 for an MDF door, $80 for solid pine, 36mm thick)
To put that in the same perspective as the paragraph above: the density of pine is around 500 kg/m3 (give or take: there' different types of pine, but average is around 500 kg/m3). The density of concrete is around 2400 kg/m3... so roughly five times higher. So your door would need to be 5 times thicker, to get the same surface density: so 75cm (29 1/2")...

36mm pine would have a surface density of around 18 kg/m2. Two layers of that would be around 36 kg/m2. Your wall has a surface density of around 360 kg/m2, so you would be short of about 90% of the needed mass... But as I've been saying several times now, in your specific case (different from most home studio cases!), you do not need to match the mass. You just need enough mass to do the job of providing your isolation number. And from that point of view, 36 kg/m2 surface density is probably in the ball park.

- Hardware: Automatic drop thresholds are non-existent, and given the current climate, I don't feel like going through the process of international shipment. Therefore I think I will rely on the seal of a normal threshold. Perhaps in the future when I visit there US or UK, I'll order one and brink it back and get it fitted at a later date.
Fair enough, but I would make a suggestion here: route the slot for that drop-down seal already, now, as you are building the door, then fill the slot with a strip of wood the same size, held in place with screws only (no glue). That way, you won't need to take off and re-hang the door when the time comes to fit the seal: just pull out the filler piece, slide in the drop-down, and you are done (assuming you have enough space to get in for access to do that). Hanging a heavy studio door just ones is hard enough already: taking it off then re-hanging it is probably classified as "severe mental abuse", or something!!... Think ahead, and make your life easier...

Heavy-duty hinges and automatic closers are no problem to find.
Even for doors that weigh as much as a small car? :) A 2" thick steel door, measuring 2m tall by 70cm wide, will weigh around 659 kg...

- Seals: The trunk rubber for the seals is also not an easy find, but I've found something that appears to have a very similar shape (photo of the cross-section supplied below). If anyone can advise whether this looks suitable, that would be very helpful. Similarly, I think can source the magnetic weatherstripping (not confirmed yet but working on it).
That should be fine. As long as it is rubber, or closed-cell foam, and is very soft, then you should be good. Stay away from hard rubber, and open-cell foams. Don't forget to allow for the thickness of the rubber when you design your door and jambs! The rubber needs to be compressed about 15% to 20% when the door is closed. Not more or less. In other words, if the rubber is 5mm thick, then when the door is closed it should not be squished down to not less than 4mm thick, nor should it be greater than 4.5mm. Yup... precision is needed when building studio doors. Many first-time studio builders assume that the rubber must be squashed as much as possible, but that's not correct: if you squash it too much, then firstly it does not properly decouple the door slab from the jamb, and secondly it puts a LOT of pressure on the automatic door closer, fighting it all the way... and if course, on the flip side of the coin, of it isn't compressed enough, then you don't get a good seal, which means your isolation is lousy.

This means that, given the width of the door is also set in stone by the supplier to a maximum of 910mm, I am unsure of how to fill in the gaps either side, and above, the door.
That 910 mm is pretty wide, for a studio door. That's great, actually, as it means you'll have plenty of clearance to get gear and instruments in and out of the room, but on the other hand, it means you will need extra hinges, and they will need to be extra-heavy duty. Think of it this way: when it is open, the door is always trying to fall off the frame. If it could fall off, the fulcrum for that motion would be the lowest hinge (the one closest to the floor). The entire door is trying to rotate around that hinge, and if all of the other hinges failed, that is what it would do. So the entire weight of the door is hanging out there, trying to tear out the TOP hinge, with all its might, by rotating around the BOTTOM hinge. So there's one hell of a lot of stress on those screws at the top, trying to pull them straight OUT of the wood! The weight of the door itself is all in the direction of "down", trying to sheer off the heads of the screws in the BOTTOM hinge, but the stress up high is in the direction of "out", trying to tear out the screws in the TOP hinge along their axis. The wider the door is, the more stress there is on those top screws.

That's a long preamble to say: with a wide door, you need MORE hinges up near the top, and they need to be tough. If not, here's what will happen:
heavy-duty-hinges-done-wrong-01-ROT.jpg
This is a photo of a heavy studio door (you can see the two layers) sent to me by an anonymous client, a while back. Notice how the wood has cracked in the door casing (frame). That cracking is due to exactly what I'm talking about here: the pressure on the screws, trying to pull them out, has succeeded in doing that: so much so, that the wood gave way, and cracked along the stress line in the wood grain. The problem here can be seen in the next photo:
heavy-duty-hinges-done-wrong-02-ROT.jpg
Look down a couple of inches below the top hinge, on the door itself: notice that it was routed, correctly, to have ANOTHER hinge there, but that extra hinge was never installed (the door casing isn't' even routed for that: just the door). So, the guy who designed and built the door knew what he was doing, and allowed for the very necessary extra hinge, but the guy who hung the door wasn't so smart... he was probably just a typical house carpenter, who has always hung doors with only three hinges, so he figured "I always did it like that, so I'll do the same here as I always do"... and a few months later, the result is this photo. Now that door has to come off completely, the casing has to be removed and replaced, then the door has to be re-hung, the seals have to be re-done, the wall around it has to be re-painted... probably a US$ 150 repair (and two days downtime for the studio...) for the cost of a US$ 10 hinge, and five minutes extra work. This is why you'll always see me saying to keep a very close eye on your contractors! Watch everything they do! If they are not used to building studios, they will just "do what I always did", without realizing the consequences of their mistakes. If you hire contractors to do work in your studio, warn them in advance that it IS a studio, and things are done differently for acoustic reasons, then give them very careful instructions, and check what they did at the end of each day, so they can fix all their errors the next day, before it is too late.

OK, so, the moral of the story: for a door slab 910mm wide, I would use three heavy duty hinges at the top (closely spaced), two in the middle, and two at the bottom. Your carpenter will probably look at you like you are crazy when you tell him to do that ("¿De verdad señor? ¿SIETE bisagras para una puerta simple? ¿Estas CHIFLADO????"), but you'll thank me a few years from now, when your door is still hanging straight, has not sagged, drooped, warped, or fallen off, and is still sealing properly all around, without binding on the threshold or jambs... and without pulling out any screws, or cracking any wood...

OK, now w can get to your REAL question! (sorry about the long ramble....)

The width of the opening is 1055mm, the width of the door is 910mm.
. So, you have 145mm to play with. Split two ways, that's 72.5mm down each side. Assuming that hypothetical rubber really is 5mm thick, you need 4mm gap for that on the outer layer of your slab, which is what matters here. So you are down to 68.5mm that you need to fill on each side of the door. Allow 6mm for truing the casing to the wall opening (since the rough opening is never square and plumb!! Ever! Not even once!), and you are down to 62.5 mm that you need to fill. That works out to almost exactly 2 1/2 inches (63.5mm), so I'd suggest that you special-order nominal 3x8 planks from your local lumber yard, which should actually be sized 2 1/2" x 7 1/4"... so they would stick out exactly 5/8" either side of the 6" thick wall, making your job of building trim around them on either side very easy! That would be the exact right size for what what you need. ... Assuming you can find a lumber yard that can produce 3x8's! If not, then get two ordinary 2x8s, plane a half inch off one of them, then just laminate them together (glue and clamp for 48 hours), to make your own.

Similarly, the height of the opening is 2390mm. The door is 2150mm high, plus the jambs on top and bottom makes a total of 2200mm. This leaves a gap above the door construction of 190mm.
I think you might be forgetting your threshold, which is probably going to be thicker than the casing lintel, but that's not the main point here: the main point is that you'll have a gap of about 190mm (give or take a few ). I would build a header up there with a few 2x8s on edge, glued and screwed. That's 184mm, leaving you 6mm for truing.

So, done like this, you would end up with a 6mm gap between the casing (or "frame" or "jamb", as you prefer!) and the rough opening in the wall. It won't actually be 6mm of course: wider at some points, narrower at others, but nominally 6mm. So you need to fill that now. Your friend here is backer rod, and caulk. Push backer rod in deep, all around the edges, as deep as you can get it (a couple of inches, if possible). Then caulk over that, with a good quality flexible caulk that never hardens. (Eg. Sikaflex 11FC). Get that caulk in deep too, right on top of the backer rod. You will need a narrow nozzle on your caulking gun, to get in deep. Make that bead about 1/4" thick (about 6mm). Note more than that, or it won't cured well. Wait for that to cure then repeat the process: more backer rod, more caulk. Rinse, repeat. Keep on going, until the entire gap is filled. Do that from BOTH sides of the door. Building it up like that gives you plenty of mass, and multiple seals. Caulk is about two to three times the density of wood, so as long as you get in a total of about 2" of actual caulk in that 6" deep gap, you are fine. The rest is backer rod, and maybe some air. So, with 1/4" beads you'd need to repeat that process 4 times to get an inch of caulk in there, then another 4 times from the other side of the wall. There's your 2".

1) Given I will be doing a double-door design, is a super-door for the outer leaf (in an effort to match the mass of the outer leaf) overkill, or is it sensible?
Even a super-door does not come close to matching the mass of 6" of concrete. It only gets maybe 20% of that, with a lot of luck. And you don't need that much in any case, as I mentioned above. You just need enough to do the job... which implies that your first step here should be figuring out how much that is! Which implies doing some testing with a sound level meter and a drum kit (or at least with a powerful set of full-range speakers that an do a decent job of pretending to be a drum kit). It also implies some patience by your neighbor! But if they are reasonable people, and you talk to them in advance explaining that you need to do that, really loud for an hour or so, in order that you can design your studio properly, and never, ever bother them again, they will probably be understanding.

2) Does the rubber seal I've managed to source appear to be a suitable replacement for the suggested type K from Rod Gervais book?
It looks fine. If that's the best you can get, then I reckon it will do the job.

3) I plan on keeping two separate jambs, and covering the gap between the leaves eventually with fabric - seem ok?
:thu: Definitely!

4) How should I go about filling up the remaining space that will be left over around the door construction?
See above... :)

Thank you for reading everyone, and thank you for this great forum!
:thu:

One last thing: You might have seen it already, but this thread should be very interesting for you: doors on a studio for a guy who teaches drums, and has neighbors close by... : site built door for high isolation That also shows how to do the multiple hinges!


- Stuart -



drummersteve
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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#3

Postby drummersteve » Tue, 2020-Jul-21, 17:41

Hola Stuart!

Wow what a great and detailed reply. Thank you for taking the time, this is exactly the kind of thing I need to help me be sure I'm making the right choices/decisions. I know there are a few people on this forum that also post on others such as Gearslutz (such as Avare/Andre), and I have a similar thread over there. I just felt it was perhaps open to a wider/more specific audience on this board, so here I am!

Firstly to clarify a few of your questions:

:shock: Wow! That's unusual! So I guess this was originally meant as a sun-room, or maybe a greenhouse?
How thick is that glass, and is it laminate glass?


Yes, it is pretty much a pergola which has been walled off to make it an inside space. The previous owners actually used it as a cinema room... they lay down some black material underneath the glass to cut out the scorching equatorial sun during the day... (it gets VERY hot in here!) I'd say the glass is about 4-5mm thick, not sure what type of glass (sorry!) I've attached a few photos below to help you picture it.

:) So you want to complicate your life a bit? :D Drums are great. I love drums. But drums are hard to isolate.... Are you on good terms with your neighbors? :) More seriously, it would be good to figure out how much isolation you need, in decibels, as that's what you would need to design for: a specific number. It's not too hard to figure that out, but you'll need a hand-held sound level meter.


Understood. This is very much future-proofing, as I don't have my drum kit here in Ecuador right now, and who knows when I'll be able to bring it over. It wouldn't be for regular use, but it seems a shame to have a Gretsch kit stuck in gig bags in the UK and not here! Neighbours, well they make more noise than I do (a huge dog on their roof barking all day and night, and an alarm which wakes up the entire street when they go to sleep and wake up...) So without wishing to sound too unprofessional, I don't care too much..!! :lol: But in seriousness, much of my isolation is about keeping outside noise out (passing cars given the proximity of the road, dogs, rain - it rains hard here!) more than my noise in. However if potential drumming or loud monitoring can be kept inside, thats the plan.

I live with my sick mother in law, whose bedroom is up and to the right of the studio (ie pretty close), and I'm more concerned about disturbing her when she sleeps, so I want to be able to have isolation the means I could monitor on my speakers, or be playing acoustic guitar/percussion, without her hearing. Also, the main entry (photo'd) joins with the living room, which has the novellas blaring from the TV pretty much all day. So, keeping that out and keeping my noise in during the day so she can continue watching is a must.

Getting hold of a sound meter not so easy (certainly not at an acceptable price at least..), do you think the sound meters you can download for your phone are worth anything? Or are they not so reliable?

Question: do you intend to play and/or record both at once? In other words, might it happen that you are thrashing away on the drums while your wife is also singing?

...
So, to clarify: your room is basically just a rehearsal room, and your wife's room is basically just a rehearsal room? There won't be any control room here, so no tracking / mixing / mastering?



No, in a word...! My day (and night) job is composing/arranging/programming music for films. This is what I do day in day out. So the ideal scenario would be me doing that kind of work in the main room, and my wife singing in her room, and the two of us not disturbing each other. I am regularly tracking instruments such as Acoustic Guitar, Violin, hand percussion, Electric guitar (DI, no amp), so thats the day-to-day level of noise I am making, along with the monitors. If/when I have my drum kit here, I may well use it to track some suspended cymbals, and less occasionally to lay down a groove, but regularly rehearsing the drums? No. And certainly not when my wife is singing. I also help my wife record/produce her work/songs, but again that would not involve her singing whilst playing drums/anything with high SPL is going on. The 'control room' so to speak is the same room where I would track everything, including the drums.

To clarify therefore: the main room is a tracking/mixing room, yes. I will be doing my composing work day in day out. I want the vocal room to function both as a recording booth for the times when I am recording my wife (or any other vocalist for that matter), but also as a separate space that she can just practice/write her music etc, without me bothering her (or indeed the other way round!) I guess you can imagine it as a mini project studio kind of setup.

Here too: if you like your sliding glass doors, then maybe you can keep your sliding glass doors. It is certainly possible to have sliders for a studio. In fact, they are rather common between rooms inside a multi-room facility (between the control room and a vocal booth or live room, for example), but they could also be used as exterior doors. Here too, the question is: how thick is the glass, and what type? Also, does the sliding part have good rubber seals on it, or if not, would it be possible to add good rubber seals to it?

Of course, if you don't like the idea of sliders on your studio, then you can just switch those out for something else.


The problem with the glass doors (and roof) is that they are just not very good seals, at all. I've attached a few pictures demonstrating what they are to give you a better idea. Currently, there isn't a seal between the roof and sliding doors (ie there is a gap I can fit a few fingers through to outside, from inside the room). The previous owners didn't do a proper job of making it a proper isolated room, mainly because they didn't need to. The glass roof makes the room way too hot, with minimal equipment, so it really has to go. The sliding doors are the cheap aluminium-framed type, and really don't do anything for sound (or heat) isolation. I suppose the glass roof could be repurposed for a small window in some way, but more than that, I think its all better off in the tip! The plan for the vocal room/booth would not utilise the full width of these sliding doors either, only half (mainly not to eat up too much of an already small garden), so all in all, its all for the trash.

Ideally, yes... assuming that you want the highest possible isolation. But you might find that you don't need to go that high with the other walls: you only need as much mass in the wall as is necessary to get the isolation you want. If one or two walls happen to have MORE mass than that, then that's fine. So you just need to figure out what the MINIMUM mass is that you need for the isolation number you want, then get at least that amount on each of your walls, and your roof. Isolation is only as good as the weakest part, but as long as the weakest part has what you need, then there's no problem if some other parts are better.


100% understood, and I'm somewhat relieved to read this! As you reiterate later, I think determining how much noise I'll make, and therefore how much isolation I need is key. Again, the SPL apps for iPhone, will they suffice?

Fair enough, but I would make a suggestion here: route the slot for that drop-down seal already, now, as you are building the door, then fill the slot with a strip of wood the same size, held in place with screws only (no glue). That way, you won't need to take off and re-hang the door when the time comes to fit the seal: just pull out the filler piece, slide in the drop-down, and you are done (assuming you have enough space to get in for access to do that). Hanging a heavy studio door just ones is hard enough already: taking it off then re-hanging it is probably classified as "severe mental abuse", or something!!... Think ahead, and make your life easier...


Great advice, and yes I'll do exactly that in this case.

OK, so, the moral of the story: for a door slab 910mm wide, I would use three heavy duty hinges at the top (closely spaced), two in the middle, and two at the bottom. Your carpenter will probably look at you like you are crazy when you tell him to do that ("¿De verdad señor? ¿SIETE bisagras para una puerta simple? ¿Estas CHIFLADO????"), but you'll thank me a few years from now, when your door is still hanging straight, has not sagged, drooped, warped, or fallen off, and is still sealing properly all around, without binding on the threshold or jambs... and without pulling out any screws, or cracking any wood...


Hahaha! I've already been speaking at length with a señor who, up until this point, is putting up with my madness. My Spanish isn't 100% yet either which is never helpful. But he understands where I'm coming from and appreciates that everything is for the sake of the acoustics. In reality, thats why I'm spending so much time researching and planning. I have no way of implementing it myself, I dont have the skills. But with the right knowledge, I can at least direct in the right way to get the best result. The workers are very skilled here, but as you say, they will 99% of the time revert to the quick and cheap option, which is what they will know very well.

I wont quote the next bit of explanation regarding filling the gaps, but it all sounds very logical to me - I had been spending some time head scratching! My one question is about the 2x8's on edge for the header. Would you fill the entire 6" width of the opening with 4 2x8's (with the 1 1/4" overhang if I go with the 3x8 lumber) to have the gap solid? Or would you just have two 2x8's, one on the inner and one on the outer edge? If the latter, what do you fill the void with? I'm appreciating that mass is key, and I'm worried this may be a weak link if its left empty? OR, have I misunderstood your suggestion completely..?!

I think I've covered everything. I have a question which may be obvious, but is definitely crucial...

When measuring the SPL, whats the process? Should I be taking measurements inside the room with the speakers at my usual monitoring volume (or replicating that of a drum kit...!), and that value I get is the value of isolation I need? Or do I take the measurement in the spaces outside of the room, to see how much is passing to the adjacent spaces, and THAT is what I need to aim for? This may well be discussed/explained somewhere, but the reality is that for all the reading I've done, I don't remember actually reading a simple explanation of this process...

I've attached a few normal photos of the space (excuse the mess, we're re-decorating so its become a bit of a dumping ground). One photo of the opening in question soon to be filled with a door, One photo of the roof from inside, one photo of the glass doors from outside, and one up above photo of the roof/room in full, to get an appreciation of location in relation to our house (on the right) and neighbours property (on the left).

I will also post another update with my plan of the vocal room. It will be extending into the garden, but not at the same width of the studio room (there are some pre-existing walls in the garden that I plan to utilise to minimise building costs). More on that once the door is organised!

Thanks again Stuart, and looking forward to any more responses!
Attachments
Door Opening 1 .JPG
Glass Sliding Doors.JPG
Glass roof.JPG
Exterior.JPG



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#4

Postby drummersteve » Fri, 2020-Jul-24, 08:58

Sorry for double-post, I cant see the option to edit. I'm just updating the post above with some new sketches of how I envisage the vocal room to be extended. As you can see, it isn't the full width of the current room. The reasons for this are:

1) The shortest wall of the vocal room (the one which is in line with a hedge) is an already-existing perimeter wall (as well as the wall to the left of this). Therefore I would only(!) have to construct the wall that contains the window and door access to the vocal room, and the vocal room wall within the garden, minimising construction and cost etc.

2) The vocal room will be extending into the garden, basically taking place of where a built-in BBQ currently is. Any more and I'm eating up garden space, which I don't want to do much more of, if I can avoid it!

Still my focus is the door, and I did have some more thoughts relating to the studio floor, an area I am admittedly unfamiliar with. However, it struck me that the design of this door (more specifically, its threshold) may be impacted by how I approach the floor in the studio... but more on that later...!
Attachments
Studio with vocal room extension 1.png
Studio with vocal room extension 2.png



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#5

Postby drummersteve » Thu, 2020-Jul-30, 22:19

Hi again Stuart/everyone reading,

Sorry for the triple post - it's not due to impatience at all. Whilst I await responses, I am reading more, searching for places to find what I need, and also implementing the suggestions into the design to see how it all fits together...

I have completed a fully-fleshed design of the door! Here is the frame:

Door Design mk1 other angle.jpg


And here with the door attached:

Door Design mk1 with door.jpg


And in-situ:

Studio with vocal room extension DOOR.jpg


Thanks for your tips, Stuart. I went back and re-measured the opening, and I was slightly off from my original post, so I've adjusted your suggestions. In brief...

1) The frame 'core' is using the 3x8's as you suggested. On top of the top 3x8 is a piece of 1x8. On top of this are two 4x6's on edge sandwiched together, leaving a gap of 5mm at the top of the opening. I have allowed for 4mm space within the frame for the door itself (ie 4mm space between the outer slab and frame), also leaving a 6mm gap between the frame and the concrete wall left and right to shim/fill with backer rod, caulk, etc.

2) The above spec is based on a threshold with the following dimensions:

threshold detail.jpg
threshold detail.jpg (27.18 KiB) Viewed 28144 times
threshold detail.jpg
threshold detail.jpg (27.18 KiB) Viewed 28144 times


...and here it is against the hypothetical jamb:

threshold detail w jamb.jpg
threshold detail w jamb.jpg (40.35 KiB) Viewed 28144 times
threshold detail w jamb.jpg
threshold detail w jamb.jpg (40.35 KiB) Viewed 28144 times


... and here it is close up with the door attached:

Threshold w door close up.jpg


Hopefully you can make out that there is a clearance (of 4mm) with the guide lines.

As a general point, it doesn't seem like they work with standard US lumber sizes here, every time I mention 2x4, they are immediately thinking in cm, not inches. So based on this design I have now, everything will have to be custom cut (an extra $2 so its really no big deal). The only thing that might benefit is the space above the door frame. I could simplify this into two pieces of what would essentially be 4x7, rather than two 4x6's on top of a 1x8. Any advantage to reducing the number of pieces above the frame? Or better to keep it as few separate pieces as possible?

Also something more structurally-related, I am assuming that for stability, the header pieces should suit on top of the uprights of the frame as I currently have it, rather than the uprights framing the header pieces either side? Seemed logical, but with zero experience in this, figured it was worth checking!

On to thresholds... Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to even find a normal threshold over here, let alone anything so specific as the Zero International that is recommended in the Rod Gervais book. Unless I'm missing something, the main 2 specialties of the Zero threshold is the Neoprene seal it has, and the thermal breaks it has (without wishing to discredit what is clearly a very well designed and built product...). I'm assuming, therefore, it's not impossible for me to build something that carries out the same function as the Zero one... enter this design. I got it from the following YT link, its made using two separate pieces of wood and slotting them together:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tR0uZbtfCA

It doesn't have the thermal break, but it allows me to carry on the rubber sealing I have all around for the outer slab, keeping a 360 degree seal.

Regarding the seals. I have seen numerous online blogs/photos/posts of people doing their own doors of this design. Of the ones that have the double-seal approach like mine does, I cannot see how they approach the bottom edge (on the threshold). As you'll see on my design, The outer slab has a 360 degree seal using the stops. However, the smaller inner slab only has seals on the top and side edges. I dont know if this was correct. Given everything I read, it seemed to me like there was only ever one seal along here... but surely not having a seal along the bottom edge of the inner slab would make the other three seals of the inner slab somewhat redundant? How is this supposed to be? Should I continue with the inner slab seal on the threshold too, like I have on the other three edges? Or is how I have it here OK?

I wanted to check something here... in your previous post, Stuart, you mentioned that the threshold would probably be thicker than the casing lintel (63.5mm). In my design, it's actually thinner, by quite a bit! You'll see that the point where the door sweeps up to the stop is 3/4" (19mm) high, and the stop itself is an additional 3/4" high. Is this a problem? Should it be thicker than this? I assumed that the thickness of the stops was appropriate at least, given that in the Gervais book design, he uses 1x stops (worth noting that all of the stops around the door, for both slabs, maintain and continue this 19mm thickness.)

My next question regarding the threshold is, how should I go about attaching it to the floor? Right now the floor is some kind of vinyl fake wood tiling, which I presume is covering a concrete base... I'm guessing I should cut out a space in the existing floor to mount the threshold/frame etc? I don't intend on keeping the floor, but similarly I don't intend on ripping it all up just yet..! Once I've exposed the concrete below, how should I mount the wooden threshold to it? I'd imagine screws, but should there be any kind of sealing agent in between? I've seen videos where people use materials such as mass-loaded vinyl to make a good seal between wooden and concrete elements, with the assistance of acoustic caulking either side of the mass loaded vinyl (ie concrete - caulk - mass loaded vinyl - caulk - wooden threshold...) What would your suggestion be? I also appreciate that removing the current tiles would drop the overall level, so I would have to adjust the height of the frame and thickness of the threshold to accommodate. Maybe even re-laying the concrete with self-levelling concrete to get a nice new flat surface to work with?

Finally, I have been searching for hours on where to find things (finding a lumber yard was hard enough, until I found out the word is 'Aserradero'! Now I know exactly where I'm going.)

The only backing rod I could find were these two entries on Mercado Libre:

IMG_3721.PNG


or

IMG_3722.PNG


Look like one of these will work?

I've also found the Sikaflex 11FC you recommended, this is considered an 'Acoustic Caulk', right? As in, I could use this to seal all my gaps in plasterboard when it comes to the walls etc? (just future-planning!)

I think that covers all of my questions for now... in brief and clear summary:

1) Is the thickness of the threshold I have implemented thick enough?

2) There is a double seal along the top and side edges, but not along the bottom edge/threshold. Is this correct? How should it be?

3) Given that all pieces of wood will be custom, am I better using the current design I have for the space above the frame, or ditching the 1x8 piece for two bigger pieces above?

4) Is the design/arrangement of the header pieces on top of the frame uprights correct?

5) How should I go about attacking the threshold to the floor... removing the current vinyl tiles? Relaying concrete? Mass-loaded vinyl/caulk in between the wood and concrete?

6) Which of the backer rods pictured (if either) looks the best option?

I've still got to track down the best hinges for the job. I've implemented the 7 hinges you suggested into the design. Also a locking mechanism suitable for such a thick door, and a closer. However, I feel like I'm gradually approaching a finalised design!

A general plan will be to get the frame set up first in place. Given the measurements are so precise in what is not necessarily a precise opening, I want to make sure this all fits as planned. Then I'll order the door (I can always get it trimmed down a little if, for example, the frame ends up being a bit smaller), fix the frame in place solidly, and then hang the door (not me, someone else who knows what they're doing...)

Thank you for reading, and thank you again in advance for any help and suggestions!



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#6

Postby drummersteve » Wed, 2020-Aug-05, 08:58

Hi everyone,

Again no intent on bumping up, but I have some more photos to share. I went back to the rubber seal supplier, and got a small sample to bring back with me. It is in fact a slightly different design to the previous picture, this one is a bit smaller which I think is actually better for my needs. On first impression, the form factor is completely wrong (in comparison to the GM trunk rubber), but given its pretty flexible, it can be somewhat forced into the correct shape to suit the purposes. Attached below...

Cross section of the rubber seal.

IMG_3115.JPG


Obviously this doesn't look right, but given the thinner part is pretty flexible, I think it can be worked into this sort of shape...

IMG_1925.JPG


For an appreciation of size...

IMG_8580.JPG


Now, I fashioned a pretend jamb/stop, and wedged the seal inside, attaching it with a few nails to the jamb first, then wedging it between the stop and jamb, and here is how it has come out:

IMG_5619.JPG


IMG_0401.JPG


IMG_6846.JPG


Its not the squidgy-est of rubbers, but there is certainly enough give to achieve the 15%-20% compression needed, without too much force against the rubber. And at the end of the day, its my only real solution right now given the lack of availability of products over here. Hopefully someone can give me a bit of reassurance with this, as its hopefully one big piece of the puzzle solved!

Cheers, Steve



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#7

Postby Soundman2020 » Wed, 2020-Aug-05, 14:13

The shape should be OK. But is it fairly soft and pliable? It seems to be from the photos. Do take into account that you need that to be many feet long, and every inch of length needs a certain amount of pressure. If it doesn't compress easily, then you might need a lot of pressure from the door closer, to keep it sealed properly.

If that's all you can find, then I guess it will have to do! :)

- Stuart -



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#8

Postby Starlight » Wed, 2020-Aug-05, 15:01

Steve, I can't say I know exactly what you need but if you can't get anything (that Stuart says is) suitable, maybe one of us here in Europe can source the right thing and send it to you.

The rolls of backer rod you showed earlier both look fine from the image. I have used mostly 6mm (because the shop didn't have 10mm in stock) and a bit of 10mm and have found it useful to have both to hand.



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#9

Postby drummersteve » Thu, 2020-Aug-06, 19:55

Thanks for the responses guys.

Stuart - yes it is reasonably pliable, it'll be a challenge to get it all sitting like that along the lengths of the stops, but with this little sample in place, it's not budging (in a good way), so I think with patience I should be able to get it seated well. It definitely has enough spring to get the 15-20% of compression you noted. It's the only thing I've found thus far, and as it comes fairly late in the assembly process, I always have the option to keep searching if it really doesn't work out I suppose...!

Really appreciate the offer of posting for me Starlight, very kind of you. It's not so much that that's the problem (I have family over there who could help me out). It's more the cost of sending things, and then the whopping taxes that the Ecuadorian customs add onto everything arriving in the country. I recently sent out some pyjamas for my mother in laws birthday (which cost £15), and was charged $70 customs charges!!

I know I've posted lots, so my questions have probably been lost. I had a couple of construction questions that I'd like some help with if possible...?! adding below:

1) Is the thickness of the threshold I have implemented thick enough? Or should I have some kind of supporting horizontal piece underneath the threshold to beef it up? (which could be recessed into the ground a bit to keep the threshold level with the current floor...)

2) There is a double seal along the top and side edges, but not along the bottom edge/threshold. Is this correct? Or is this where the drop seal comes in?

3) How should I go about attaching the threshold to the floor... I'd imagine removing the porcelain tiles first... then relaying concrete and screwing the threshold directly to this? Mass-loaded vinyl/caulk in between the wood and concrete? And if the threshold should be beefed up, another piece of wood below the threshold?

4) somewhat related to the above point, the two uprights of the frames will be resting on edge on the floor in my current design... should there be some kind of mass loaded vinyl between them and the concrete? or maybe this also answers my other question, attaching them to a horizontal piece below the threshold to support them, and having mass loaded vinyl below all of it...

hope the questions make sense, thanks again both for your input!

EDIT - Stuart, I've just re-read your post about creating the super door for a drummer, and I noticed you have the double seal going all the way round, with the triple seal being complete by the drop threshold on the outer edge. So this answers my question there! I'll have to look how to work the second seal into the design.



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#10

Postby drummersteve » Sat, 2020-Aug-22, 11:16

Hi everyone!

So some exciting news, I bought my first pieces of wood for the frame! I opted for a hard wood that they call 'Sandy Rojo' over here, they said it was the strongest wood they have, which I figured would probably serve me best in supporting the heavy door, and similarly the density would be closer to the concrete doors. It's heavy wood thats for sure!

As you can see from the design of the frame as a whole, it has the header sitting on top of the uprights (given the weight of whats above, I felt that this was the best way around to support the weight), with the arrangement of filler pieces above the header to fill the space.

Studio with vocal room extension DOOR.jpg


Door Design mk1 with door small.jpeg


(The design is slightly different to this one - it no longer has the thin piece immediately above the header. Is is now just the header, and then the two extra pieces on edge.)

My question is simple, and probably an easy answer, but I imagine very important... how should I go about attaching all of these pieces together? I imagine a combination of long heavy duty screws, along with some wood glue... but maybe I'm wrong?

The lumber yard aren't used to such specific dimensions, so they cut the wood a few mm too big for my design on all edges. So I'm going to plane off the excess today with my power hand planer, and then begin figuring out how to mount it all together and get it sat in the opening.

I've also removed the porcelain tiles from the section of the floor where the door will go. It looks a mess, but ultimately I'll be replacing the entire floor of the studio, so I'm not worried about the damaged tiles (the dark ones are the studio ones). I'm going to fill the small gap with concrete today matching the width of the door frame, up to the level of the floor in the living room, to mount the threshold onto at a later date. The threshold will overhang on both sides, so the transition will be smooth for now despite the mess.

IMG_7317.JPG


If anyone can advise on the best way to attach all these various elements of the frame/filler above, together, I would be extremely appreciative!
Thanks guys!!



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#11

Postby drummersteve » Fri, 2020-Oct-23, 10:28

Hi all,

Good news - progress! The door is up! Still a way to go, but we are moving closer!

The beastly frame is bolted into the concrete with lag screws either side; the space above the header is filled with two big pieces of wood; hinges all mortised (by hand w/ chisel) and installed (this took some time tweaking to get just right, and the door opens and closes perfectly!); have made my custom threshold out of wood that sits at the bottom.

IMG_4243.JPG
door!


IMG_4245.JPG
filler above header


IMG_4244.JPG
threshold


I've not attached the second inner core to the main outer door yet. Reason being that with the extra weight, it would be much harder to balance in position, and to get it level and straight to then mark/install the hinges. Now I have the hinges installed, I will be removing the door, staining it (along with the frame), and attaching the second core to the inside of it (also stained)... this way, I wont have to be checking and tweaking and moving with all the extra weight - should just go up into place! I don't envisage any sagging from the extra weight, purely because the jamb is this massively chunky and hard wood (you'll see from the photos below) - heavy as hell!

I can already see that the gap on the hinge side is smaller than on the strike side of the frame, and as this door is basically impossible to shim behind the jambs given the thickness/hardness of the wood, I will shim behind the hinges themselves to move the entire door over all a touch to even out the gap between slab and frame.

IMG_4241.JPG
gap hinge side


IMG_4242.JPG
gap strike side


Just in case, I've left the lag bolts exposed for now, in case I need to tighten any up a little bit first (although doubt this will make any difference.) Once the extra heavy door is on and plumb, with appropriate space all around, I will be tightening up the lags all the way until they are fully counter-sunk, and then fill in the holes (not sure how yet, will figure that one out soon! Probably a mixture of same-coloured saw dust and wood glue). Then, I'll be sealing the gap between frame and concrete w/ backer rod and caulk.

Next step is the seals. This is the part I'm most worried about, given my previous posts about being not quite the right shape... it requires some manual deforming to sit snug in the bevel insert that I will be creating for the stops, so it will be an interesting test to see whether it will stand up to the test. The store didn't have enough for me the other day, but supposedly will have more today, so thats what my weekend job is... buying the rubber, bevelling the stops appropriately, and then installing the stops/seals.

Then a hydraulic door closer, door handle, and ball-latch to finish it off... and figure out some kind of door trim to go all round...

I'll attach a few photos of all of the above. Still a way to go, but happy that as a very inexperienced DIY-er, I've got this far, everything lining up perfectly and working as it should. Fingers crossed!

PS apologies for the orientation of the photos... hopefully you can see what I mean!



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#12

Postby SoWhat » Fri, 2020-Oct-23, 16:49

Well done indeed!!!

How's your back???

then fill in the holes (not sure how yet, will figure that one out soon! Probably a mixture of same-coloured saw dust and wood glue).


Wood filler is paintable, and you will be able to mix up some color to match.



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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#13

Postby drummersteve » Sat, 2020-Oct-24, 13:11

How's your back???


Haha! Fine, for now. I only put up one slab. I've gotta take it down and attach the second slab to it this weekend... ask me again next week!

I'll see what the deal is regarding wood filler over here, not something I've seen on the shelves (surely must be available somewhere..) Will post updates!

I do have a question actually - I've been experimenting with how to rabbet the stops to mount the seals. I've so far got two possible options, as far as I can see...

1) as per the Rod Gervais book (my seal isn't same shape so its a little bit forced into position...)

IMG_4256.JPG


IMG_4257.JPG


IMG_4258.JPG


2) following the shape of the seal (although I worry that going through the cross section of the wood like this would weaken the stop?)

IMG_4260.JPG

this one not cut very well, experimenting with the circular saw is a bit cumbersome!

IMG_4261.JPG

this one tighter, but needs a bit of rounding at the top for it to sit better...



Any opinions on best approach much appreciated! :thu:



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Soundman2020
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Home studio design - first step, a door!

#14

Postby Soundman2020 » Thu, 2021-Jun-24, 23:01

Hey Steve, I really do hope you are still around! I'm playing catch-up on old threads, now that I'm getting back into the swing of things after a longish absence! If you still need help with your build, it would be great if you could update your thread with the latest status, maybe some recent pics, and let me know where you are at, and where you are going!

- Stuart -




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